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10.2a Oct. 2012 Edition
https://www.stevehopwoodforex.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=861
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Author:  nanningbob [ Wed Oct 03, 2012 1:36 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 10.2a Oct. 2012 Edition

garyfritz wrote:
nanningbob wrote:We have been married 37 years and still kiss each other once in a while. My wife graduated from Poudre High School Class of 73.
Lucky man. Wish it had worked out that way for me.

Your wife graduated one year ahead of me, but I was in Iowa at the time. My sons are at Poudre now. You'll have to tell her Fort Collins has changed just a teensy bit since her high school days. :lol:

FWIW: I've been doing a bit of study to understand the 10.2a behavior a bit better. I wondered if the DP>WP>MP or DP<WP<MP condition was a strong enough signal by itself. I wrote up a small test system to go long or short when the pivots lined up, and go flat when they weren't. It's pretty close to a breakeven, meaning "pivots lined up" is not a great indicator of "good trend to jump on." There are just too many cases where the pivots line up just as the market reverses.

I tried combining it with slope in a simple-minded way and that didn't work either.

I also tried adding simple volatility-based TP and SL, and those helped slightly.

So: since people do seem to be making money with this beastie, that says to me the pivots aren't the magic. It's how you manage the trade once you're in it.
I assume you used the Empty4 tester or a similar program. The problem with test programs is they dont convey the individual decision of each trade, they try to feed a certain if a then b then c etc which in a dynamic Forex world doesnt work. For example I know that the AUD lowered their interest rate yesterday and that will bring down the AUD over time. Because the NZD is tied to the Australian economy it will eventually come down also. That is something that cannot be tested in a tester but you will not find me buying either one right now. The exception being which I learned this summer is the CHF doesnt want to be a safe haven currency, the USD, JPY, GBP are not attractive safe haven currencies right now so up went the AUD and NZD. They are simply too small of currencies to be safe havens for a long period of time so when that is done they should make a nice drop in the near future. However, if some country in Europe hits the news again I wouldnt be surprised if they once again make a short term safe haven to store money for a while.

These individual decisions are not reflected in a test program.

Point 2, at some point you have to close a trade in a tester by some criteria. I have found by studying each individual trade that many trades it counts as a loss were once a profitable trade and you can change the entire results of a test by taking profits on trades the tester counted as a loss.

Point 3 if you trade like I do and multi level trade then some trades that count as losers are really break evens in the real world. So I do not find tester programs really show what will happen in the real world. The value of testers is to see if an EA works properly and if you look at each individual trade and not the test results page, you can get an idea of the strategy. I guess I should start a thread and talk about this subject.

I could give some more points but I think you get the picture. I have never found a tester program that really accurately gives results that would exist in real time. Just too many variables that it cant test.
Author:  nanningbob [ Wed Oct 03, 2012 4:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 10.2a Oct. 2012 Edition

My 10.2a trade of the day. Eur/usd buy
Author:  nanningbob [ Wed Oct 03, 2012 4:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 10.2a Oct. 2012 Edition

chf.jpy buy
Author:  garyfritz [ Wed Oct 03, 2012 4:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 10.2a Oct. 2012 Edition

I assume you used the Empty4 tester or a similar program. The problem with test programs is they dont convey the individual decision of each trade, they try to feed a certain if a then b then c etc which in a dynamic Forex world doesnt work.
Yes, I used Tradestation to test it. I trust it far more than Empty4's backtester. Its backtests are very accurate -- but only if YOU trade what the system does. If you use fuzzy ill-defined decision processes in your trading -- and most good discretionary traders DO -- and if you use all kinds of rules-of-thumb to manage your trades, then no EA or other tester is likely to duplicate what you do.

I understand that my test system is doing dumb mechanical operations. This works fabulously if I can find some system logic that is profitable with dumb mechanical operations, but that's gotten a WHOLE lot harder than it used to be. Too many robots trading the market, most likely.

Trouble is, I don't have your experience and gift for trading. I can't duplicate what you do. I had hoped that the pivot signals might be strong enough that I could use them as a starting point for further development, but it seems they aren't.

I tried adding simple volatility-based profit targets to see if I could turn some losing trades into winners. That didn't seem to help much.

If I'm going to benefit from your work, I'm going to have to find a way to manage these trades that actually works. Unfortunately that's not my strength, but unfortunately my strength (building mechanical systems) doesn't seem to work here. I'll have to dig through some trades and see what I can learn. Please keep posting your trades, with commentary of how/why you made your decisions if possible -- those are really helpful for people trying to understand what you're doing. Explanations of why you decided NOT to take a trade -- like your comments about AUD, NZD, CHF, etc -- are also invaluable!

Thanks Bob!
Author:  lvdfx888 [ Wed Oct 03, 2012 5:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 10.2a Oct. 2012 Edition

nanningbob wrote:chf.jpy buy
Hi Bob,

The pivots are WP<MP<DP for CHFJPY, should it be lined up as MP<WP<DP and the trigger is price crosses up DP?

Thanks
Ron
Author:  nanningbob [ Wed Oct 03, 2012 6:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 10.2a Oct. 2012 Edition

lvdfx888 wrote:
nanningbob wrote:chf.jpy buy
Hi Bob,

The pivots are WP<MP<DP for CHFJPY, should it be lined up as MP<WP<DP and the trigger is price crosses up DP?

Thanks
Ron
Your right but will stay with the trade for now
Author:  phil_trade [ Wed Oct 03, 2012 6:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 10.2a Oct. 2012 Edition

nanningbob wrote:chf.jpy buy
Hi Bob
It would be great if you post when and why you close your trade. It's quite clear now for the entry, but for me, need some examples for the exit

thks

Phil


edit : Example MultiBob 10.2 H4 Trend trade with missed TP : how did you manage it to exit ?
H4 Trend Trade 10.2 missed TP.PNG
Author:  GT3RS [ Wed Oct 03, 2012 7:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 10.2a Oct. 2012 Edition

Great thread Bob! Many thanks for sharing.

My first 10.2a trade below. I had to sit through a bit of drawdown, but nothing too painful.

Did I see it correctly?

I'm now keeping an eye on TMA slope for my exit. Will take partial profits at WR1 and possibly move SL to break even.

Cheers,

Rob
Author:  alex_forex [ Wed Oct 03, 2012 10:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 10.2a Oct. 2012 Edition

nanningbob wrote:My 10.2a trade of the day. Eur/usd buy
Multibob took this one @1.29250

Regards
Alex
Author:  phil_trade [ Wed Oct 03, 2012 11:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 10.2a Oct. 2012 Edition

alex_forex wrote:
nanningbob wrote:My 10.2a trade of the day. Eur/usd buy
Multibob took this one @1.29250

Regards
Alex
Pressure is on BOB... will he close better than multi Bob ? :lol:
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