Multi 10:4 Trader EA

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MrLong

Re: Multi 10:4 Trader EA

Post by MrLong »

SWG123 wrote:
MrLong wrote:
SWG123 wrote:
MrLong wrote: You could try GridMethod set to 1.

Andy
Nope, that doesn't work either, still not picking up the second trade.
That's why I entered the magic numbers in the comment, to try debug, can you give me a screen shot of the terminal.

Andy
Aha, now we're getting somewhere - magic number doesn't appear in Terminal comments field, but it does show (albeit very briefly) in the mouse hover. Curious ...
terminal.GIF
Drop this line of code inside one of the main functions like the
Running trades function, then recompile:

Alert(symbol", ", OrderMagicNumber());

If should list the magic numbers for the pairs.

Andy
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glabbeek
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Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2012 8:09 am
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Re: Multi 10:4 Trader EA

Post by glabbeek »

slipshod wrote:
glabbeek wrote:Recently you added the trailpercent exit. This method of exit already locked in many profits for us and is a good addition to the strategy.

I'm wondering why you opted for using the basket method. I never understood the use of using baskets and nobody has ever been able to show me the advantage of using baskets.

You only should manage your account, that is your basket!

If I would say to you: "The AUDCAD is up 5%, so buy GBPCHF, NZDUSD and EURJPY", would you think is logical? probably not. So why would you accept this on the exit side?
I hope you don't mind my jumping in - I'm a little confused by what you're asking. You say the trailpercent is a good addition and has locked in profits, but then question why its been added & can't see the advantage? Isn't that a little contradictory? Also the example you provide is relating to entries, but the EA only basket-manages trades that are already running, with entries judged on individual pairs alone.
Let's say you have a basket that is performing good. It has 5 pairs in the basket and 4 are each up 4 percent and rising. (so 16 percent total) One stock is going down 5 percent. What would you like to happen? Close the whole basket, or just the one losing pair?
In a case like you describe here, the falling trade could potentially drop the overall profit and hit the trailing percentage, which would indeed close the whole basket. It would depend on how sharply that one trade's falling compared to the four others are rising, how tight the trailingpercent stop is, and where the individual losing trade's stop-loss is - if it stopped out the problem would be solved.

Truth is no-one knows what the market will do next. That trade could turn around and run into profit while the others stall and reverse. At some point you have to make a decision to take money off the table and await new entries, and the advantage of the trailpercent is that you know for sure that a proportion of profit gained is going to be kept - not lost because the trader lacks judgement & lets winners turn to losers (or is asleep while the market moves overnight).
You are right about the function of the trailing stop. That is why I brought up the idea in the first place. What I want to point out (and I see that I wasn't very clear) is that you should not approach your exit as an basket.

Give me 1 good reason why closing a basket would amount to bigger profits, or smaller losses, than individual exits.

Why, if the USDCHF is dropping, would that mean you also need to exit the GBPCAD? there is no correlation.
Only if the EURUSD and the USDCAD are loosing than you could expect the EURCAD to be rising. In this last case there is a correlation and you could use this in a basket.

I start with saying that the trailpercent has locked in some gains and therefore it is working, but I think it is a blunt object and would be far more effective if it was used per pair in stead of in a basket.

"Cut your losses and let your profits run"
Regards,
Willem-Bram
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glabbeek
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Posts: 104
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2012 8:09 am
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Re: Multi 10:4 Trader EA

Post by glabbeek »

MrLong wrote:
glabbeek wrote:Hi Andy,

I'm still following your efforts on this complex EA.

Recently you added the trailpercent exit. This method of exit already locked in many profits for us and is a good addition to the strategy.

I'm wondering why you opted for using the basket method. I never understood the use of using baskets and nobody has ever been able to show me the advantage of using baskets.

You only should manage your account, that is your basket!

If I would say to you: "The AUDCAD is up 5%, so buy GBPCHF, NZDUSD and EURJPY", would you think is logical? probably not. So why would you accept this on the exit side?

Let's say you have a basket that is performing good. It has 5 pairs in the basket and 4 are each up 4 percent and rising. (so 16 percent total) One stock is going down 5 percent. What would you like to happen? Close the whole basket, or just the one losing pair?

Just my thought.
Hi,

I see basket trading as giving the trader an edge, where as a bookie more or less always wins, why does he win?

In my opinion, it's because there are, let's say eight horses in a race, the guy goes into the bookies and places a bet, he thinks horse number 2 will win, so he has 1 chance of winning, the bookie has 7 chances of winning. So if we have 8 trades rolling at the same time, I think with the 10.4 strategy we have more chance of winning than losing if we cash the basket in for a profit.

On the other hand, you are right in what you are saying, why cut winning trades?
How long will they be winning trades?

I'm always looking for ideas that can give us an edge, so if you have any that we could implement
I'd be please have a look at the ideas.

You can switch off the basket settings by entering a 0.

Many Thanks
Andy
Hi Andy,

The same way you approach the trailing profit for the whole basket you cloud do this per pair. For each pair that is in trade you would look for the highest profit point and when the price drops 1% (debatable) this value you would close that trade. You could still show the locked in profit for the whole basket.

I think you are right about the broker$, the edge is on their side. I would be suprised if basket trading could tip the scale to our side.

I don't know how the rest is doing, but so far most, if not all, of my winnings come from the trailing profit basket exit. If it could be improved we could win even more.

Your work is really getting to a superb level and the EA is giving me a lot of confidence.
Regards,
Willem-Bram
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slipshod
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Location: Australia

Re: Multi 10:4 Trader EA

Post by slipshod »

Hi Willem-Bram, I understand where you're coming from. I don't think I've had a single trade run to its TP level yet - all profit has been from the newly introduced trailing percentage feature, prior to which I kept seeing the account wander back and forth between a state of equity gain or loss & hoping stops wouldn't be hit.

So its an improvement, but you're right to question whether it alone is an answer. Perhaps individual trailing stops would help, I'm not sure. Couldn't hurt to try it if Andy had time & inclination to implement the idea.

Edit: Just checked through the history of my longest-running demo for this EA (3 weeks) - of dozens of trades, 7 have indeed hit their TP levels while 14 have hit the Stop Loss. That's only a 33% success rate & with many stops further away than the TPs, it'd make for an account-draining system. Its only in profit due to the trailing percent feature and the fact that on a couple of occasions I closed baskets manually. Another of my demos (Pepper-stone) has run for 2 weeks, was 1.5% in profit and has now dropped 1.5% into loss on its balance with a series of bad trades over the last 2 days, and is currently sitting on 3% loss on two running trades.

In short I still don't know if this system is basically profitable or not, or if the trailing percent feature adds to its profitability or detracts from it. Time will tell.
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Jonathan2FI
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Re: Multi 10:4 Trader EA close all

Post by Jonathan2FI »

Hi
I think I am going to have to play sherlock.... aplari 3 trades running in drawdown visable in dash and visable in terminal check respective charts don't like the look of them becuase of PA, slope strength and relationship to 240 and so click on close all open - trades disapear from dash. Make cup of tea..return trades still running (but not on dash) in terminal DD double mmm don't panic or swear at the EA ... a small blip. Any ideas before I start my own research?
no restarts no change of magic no.s
Jonathan
MrLong

Re: Multi 10:4 Trader EA

Post by MrLong »

glabbeek wrote:
slipshod wrote:
glabbeek wrote:Recently you added the trailpercent exit. This method of exit already locked in many profits for us and is a good addition to the strategy.

I'm wondering why you opted for using the basket method. I never understood the use of using baskets and nobody has ever been able to show me the advantage of using baskets.

You only should manage your account, that is your basket!

If I would say to you: "The AUDCAD is up 5%, so buy GBPCHF, NZDUSD and EURJPY", would you think is logical? probably not. So why would you accept this on the exit side?
I hope you don't mind my jumping in - I'm a little confused by what you're asking. You say the trailpercent is a good addition and has locked in profits, but then question why its been added & can't see the advantage? Isn't that a little contradictory? Also the example you provide is relating to entries, but the EA only basket-manages trades that are already running, with entries judged on individual pairs alone.
Let's say you have a basket that is performing good. It has 5 pairs in the basket and 4 are each up 4 percent and rising. (so 16 percent total) One stock is going down 5 percent. What would you like to happen? Close the whole basket, or just the one losing pair?
In a case like you describe here, the falling trade could potentially drop the overall profit and hit the trailing percentage, which would indeed close the whole basket. It would depend on how sharply that one trade's falling compared to the four others are rising, how tight the trailingpercent stop is, and where the individual losing trade's stop-loss is - if it stopped out the problem would be solved.

Truth is no-one knows what the market will do next. That trade could turn around and run into profit while the others stall and reverse. At some point you have to make a decision to take money off the table and await new entries, and the advantage of the trailpercent is that you know for sure that a proportion of profit gained is going to be kept - not lost because the trader lacks judgement & lets winners turn to losers (or is asleep while the market moves overnight).
You are right about the function of the trailing stop. That is why I brought up the idea in the first place. What I want to point out (and I see that I wasn't very clear) is that you should not approach your exit as an basket.

Give me 1 good reason why closing a basket would amount to bigger profits, or smaller losses, than individual exits.

Why, if the USDCHF is dropping, would that mean you also need to exit the GBPCAD? there is no correlation.
Only if the EURUSD and the USDCAD are loosing than you could expect the EURCAD to be rising. In this last case there is a correlation and you could use this in a basket.

I start with saying that the trailpercent has locked in some gains and therefore it is working, but I think it is a blunt object and would be far more effective if it was used per pair in stead of in a basket.

"Cut your losses and let your profits run"
Yes, we can add the same function as an option to single pairs also.
MrLong

Re: Multi 10:4 Trader EA close all

Post by MrLong »

Jonathan2FI wrote:Hi
I think I am going to have to play sherlock.... aplari 3 trades running in drawdown visable in dash and visable in terminal check respective charts don't like the look of them becuase of PA, slope strength and relationship to 240 and so click on close all open - trades disapear from dash. Make cup of tea..return trades still running (but not on dash) in terminal DD double mmm don't panic or swear at the EA ... a small blip. Any ideas before I start my own research?
no restarts no change of magic no.s
Jonathan
Hi Jonathan,

Do you have a shot of the terminal?

Thanks
Andy
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rosst
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Location: Austin, Texas

Re: Multi 10:4 Trader EA

Post by rosst »

MrLong wrote:
rosst wrote:I am getting this message over and over: Order, EURGBP,Short closed by BE function
but no orders have been closed or even look like it applies...
I have closed and restarted but it still goes on....
Hi

I don't know what's happening there, you can turn that function off by changing useAverageBE to false..

Andy
Thanks for the reply Andy - I removed the EA - reinstalled it and it was still doing it - so I closed all trades and it stopped if it happens again I will try to change the setting you suggest...
Thanks again for sharing this great work.
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glabbeek
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Location: In the middle of the Netherlands

Re: Multi 10:4 Trader EA

Post by glabbeek »

It is important to realise that the trailing profit stop does not cutt your losses, it just cut's your winnings.
Sounds bad, but it is not. The stop just makes sure that winners don't turn into lossers.

Cutting losses needs a whole other approach.

Also a 33 percent profitable system doesn't need to be bad. If your average win is twice the size of your loss, than you are on a point of break even. You need a R (risk factor of 2:1 or more)

I think it would be wise to first make sure that the entry is according Bob's 10.4 system and no errors are found on this. Then run 3 system at the same conditions. One without a trailing stop, one with the basket and one per currency pair.

Let these run for a few weeks, before we start to tweak.
Regards,
Willem-Bram
veeyem
Trader
Posts: 21
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 12:59 pm

Re: Multi 10:4 Trader EA

Post by veeyem »

I am seeing the below msgs in the Experts tab. - a new error msg appears almost every 30 seconds.

2013.04.04 10:09:51 Multi_10_4_EAv1.09 USDSGDm,H4: object name passed to ObjectSetText function cannot be an uninitialized or empty string
2013.04.04 10:09:38 Multi_10_4_EAv1.09 USDSGDm,H4: object name passed to ObjectSetText function cannot be an uninitialized or empty string
2013.04.04 10:09:35 Multi_10_4_EAv1.09 USDSGDm,H4: object name passed to ObjectSetText function cannot be an uninitialized or empty string
2013.04.04 10:09:30 Multi_10_4_EAv1.09 USDSGDm,H4: object name passed to ObjectSetText function cannot be an uninitialized or empty string
2013.04.04 10:09:21 Multi_10_4_EAv1.09 USDSGDm,H4: object name passed to ObjectSetText function cannot be an uninitialized or empty string
2013.04.04 10:08:52 Multi_10_4_EAv1.09 USDSGDm,H4: object name passed to ObjectSetText function cannot be an uninitialized or empty string
2013.04.04 10:08:41 Multi_10_4_EAv1.09 USDSGDm,H4: object name passed to ObjectSetText function cannot be an uninitialized or empty string
...
...

Regards,
VeeYem
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